Feminism / Sex

Pickup Artists are Essentially Vermin


We all know pickup artists are a major gross-out. On its own, being able to win someone over and spend the night with them is pretty cool! But we all know that isn’t what pickup artists are about. Their techniques are aimed at overcoming the byzantine rules of social interaction and bypassing bullshit that women pull like “not being sure they want to sleep with this guy,” and “just wanting to get drinks with friends.” To them, sex is part of a power game, and rejection isn’t an option. The interaction only ends when the Artist says it does. The pickup system operates on an adversarial worldview where women are the enemy, denying access to men’s sexual gratification, and this comes through clearly enough that basically anyone paying attention will “pick up” on it.

It’s bad enough that PUAs are so sleazy and ruthless, but there’s something deeper, something viscerally repulsive about what they do. Many of their problems stem from a society that has rigid sexist expectations for each gender, and while they do understand this, they don’t make an attempt to rise above. Species can develop into vermin if introduced into regions where they find favorable living conditions, and if they face few or no natural enemies there. They are defined by their adaptability, their tenacity and will to survive. PUAs fail as men in a patriarchal society, and instead of redefining what a man is, they are satisfied with moving to the margins, living in garbage, and becoming rats.

Pickup Artists Constantly Live in Survival Mode


You know those ads you get on porn sites that are like “Sleep with ANY woman, GUARANTEED”? You know those, right? Like, everyone does, right?

It’s one of the archetypal male fantasies. It suggests that women saying “no” will never be a problem for you. The ad also appeals to the idea that women aren’t supposed to say “no,” that their sexuality is an open commodity (salesman “GUARANTEED”). This is of course not practically the case, however strongly the concept is socially reinforced, and it causes problems for a lot of men when they bump into the reality of women turning them down. Nobody likes being rejected. But many people HATE being rejected, and just about as many are afraid of it.

PUA can be and is used by men who are already sexually successful. It “steps up their game,” as they would say. But the way it’s constructed, with the smallest details such as eye movement and position accounted for, is for men who are not successful. It’s comprehensive as FUCK, because that’s the level of dysfunction it’s attempting to address. Possibly these men don’t understand how to talk to or approach women. They’re shy, just generally clueless, or frustrated that for all their efforts they haven’t achieved a single f-close.

It comes down to a fear of rejection. PUA is built around techniques that are aimed at breaking down defenses and easing women into things and moving steadily forward in a way that prevents them from ever saying “no.” This objective, again, seems fine. There’s nothing wrong with being so smooth that you get from introduction to bed with no hitch. The point, though, is that pickup is the art of avoiding rejection.

Pickup is also arranged like a game. Women are scored (HB 1-10), techniques and strategies are named and heavily regimented, trip reports are made to analyze weaknesses in game and congratulate victories. Each interaction ideally ends with a “close,” Which is generally kiss- number- or fuck-. This structure means that every misstep is a potential crisis. PUAs are fighting to survive.

Pickup Artists Think They’re Leveling the Playing Field


Rejection is seen as one of the ultimate weapons when it comes to sexual interaction. Supposedly, when a woman tells you she’s not interested, that’s the end of it. They have the power to definitively end things (though the man often has the actual power here, as it’s up to them whether they accept it or persist). Because of this power, PUAs, and a lot of men in general, feel at a disadvantage because they don’t have a magic button that gets them what they wanted. So they turn to pickup, whose entire purpose is to nullify the power of rejection by ensuring it never gets used. It’s a counter to women’s many defenses such as Bitch Shields, Shit Tests, and Last Minute Resistance.

People will often include in their anti-PUA screeds qualifying statements that PUA techniques work. They’ll say “it’s good for men to gain confidence and know how to present/sell themselves, learn how to get over the fear of rejection and accept it when it comes.” And this is true. There’s elements of self-help to PUA that are generally good life advice. But while the techniques can work, they need to be used properly, in that they need to seem genuine and natural, making PUA an exercise in sociopathy. Worse, such acknowledgements often leave out where PUAs got this information in the first place. What insights do they have that they can construct a system like this, that, performed correctly, is fairly successful?

Pickup Artists Thrive on a Poisonous System

The rules of the seduction community were written specifically to take advantage of cracks and problems in the patriarchal system. Kino, the usage of physical contact to progress a flirtation, directs PUAs to touch women in an escalating way. Starting from touches that “no reasonable woman” would object to, and moving up the scale on the assumption that the woman will continue allowing it, Kino works with the knowledge that it’s expected of women to be nice and friendly (“smile!”) and not reject people. It works with the feelings induced by these expectations. The escalation scale is not only an attempt to slowly ramp up physical contact, but also an attempt to play off women’s fears of looking inconsistent, frigid, or unreasonable.

“Don’t assume she doesn’t like being touched, just keep touching until she pulls away or says something.”

PUAs understand (or have been taught) the mechanisms of patriarchy to such a degree that they “meta-game” and carry out interactions with the opposite sex not inside the particular set of rules we live under, but USING those rules. They can see the full face of patriarchy, how it directs women to act, how it limits the ways women can respond to unwanted attention. And instead of adjusting their behavior to make everyone more comfortable, they use the profound problems of a male-centric society to get laid. Instead of passively benefiting from patriarchy like the average man, PUAs actively latch on and carry out all of their romantic interactions fully aware of the advantages they’re afforded.

They are completely at home in this environment. PUAs are broken examples of patriarchy’s model man, but they are a perfect product of patriarchy itself. They fill a niche by occupying the shittiest parts of a garbage-ass system. Their misguided view that women have all the power leads them to seek out more power, by understanding the rules of the game in such a way that they don’t simply benefit from patriarchy, but live it.

    Ash: You still don't understand what you're dealing with, do you? Perfect organism. Its structural perfection is matched only by its hostility.     Lambert: You admire it.     Ash: I admire its purity. A survivor... unclouded by conscience, remorse, or delusions of morality.

Ash: You still don’t understand what you’re dealing with, do you? Perfect organism. Its structural perfection is matched only by its hostility.

Lambert: You admire it.

Ash: I admire its purity. A survivor… unclouded by conscience, remorse, or delusions of morality.

There’s a lot more to talk about when it comes to PUAs, but to be honest I just wanted to make the argument that they are human cockroaches.


28 thoughts on “Pickup Artists are Essentially Vermin

  1. Quite a ranty article. I didn’t like the parts about equating self-betterment to sociopathy, the sentence where you said that breaking down defenses and preventing people from saying “no” was fine and especially the part about comparing PUAS to vermin. Also the part about men having the actual power when a woman decides to end the conversation is, thankfully, wrong.

    • “ranty article” = “I don’t like your tone,” which is not something we care about on this site.

      How is the last thing you mentioned wrong? Men have actual power in society, which includes being able to override consent and insulting women or taking it personally when a woman doesn’t want to interact with them. Women have to say no multiple times because rape culture teaches us that women don’t mean it, or puts pressures against women being firm because otherwise they’re stuck up bitches if they “don’t even want to talk,” when actually just a lot of women don’t want to be hit on.

      • I don’t care too much about tone as long as it’s not dehumanizing (like comparing people to vermin) and called the article ranty because of the unclear / misleading paragraphs pointed out.

        Having to say no multiple times or very clearly is not quite the same as not having the power to end a conversation. If the guy still persists, it’s time to escalate the problem to bystanders, owners or security.

        Societal pressures and internalized sexism like the label of the stuck up bitch are the real problem here and should be adressed as such, not as vaque powers of men.

        • Oh dehumanizing people like referring to them as a number representing their “value?”
          What you’re describing is called “making a scene.” nobody likes doing it and women are expected not to. The point is that pickup, as a weapon against rejection, is disproportionate.
          I’m well aware that societal pressures and internalized sexist need to be done away with, and this was in fact the basis of my argument. Pickup artists use these problems as tools. They wallow in sewage; they are vermin.

          • Yes, pickup artists can be dehumanizing too. If you want to have the moral high ground, you shouldn’t.

            Asking for help in defusing a situation like this is not “making a scene”, it’s just common sense. A person who does not respect personal boundries when directly told to is dangerous and should not be tolerated by anyone.

            Again, I can understand the anger and frustration, but dehumanizing language is alwaysinappropriate.

        • “Societal pressures and internalized sexism like the label of the stuck up bitch are the real problem here and should be adressed as such, not as vaque powers of men.”

          So essentially you are saying that we should not hold pickup artists accountable for taking advantage of awful, sexist societal pressures that are already in place?

          • No, I think pickup artists should be hold accountable and sexist attitudes in society should be challenged and abolished.

            However, I’m a fan of clear language and dislike statements about nebolous powers, magic PUA skills and especially assertions that are disempowering to women.

      • ARI LAUREL, men do not have the power to override consent without serious legal and social consequences. It is explicitly against the law. Women also have actual power in society. Now it may be that they have less power than men, but to argue that women in western society are powerless is ludicrous beyond words. Women do use their ability to without sexual access from men, as well as being physically desirable, to their advantage and particularly when it comes to flirting, getting hired, and advancing their employment rank. It takes 2 to Tango.

    • I didn’t like the parts about equating self-betterment to sociopathy,

      Me neither, LYZZY. People who try to equate those on the bottom of the social order seeking to better themselves, advance their social rank(what many call upwardly mobile)with sociopaths are privileged people with a sense of entitlement. They believe they should get to not only enjoy their privilege and not have to worry about competition from those that they view as inferior(so-called “vermin”). Adaptability is the key to success and happiness in life. That is PRECISELY what pickup artists are doing! Unlike the whiny, narcissistic MRAs who blog about how unfair the world is and all the injustices done to them to which they place the blame squarely on feminism, these are guys who do not try to play the victim and take responsibility for figuring out how to get what they want. I am not disputing that “No means NO”. Or that it’s acceptable to manipulate people. But as they say: All is fair in love and war.

      • Not quite. You have no idea of my position in the social order. You’re also disregarding the thrust of my argument. Pickup artists adapt, but they adapt to use a poisonous system to their advantage. Adaptability and “not playing the victim” aren’t positive things if it results in a lifestyle that is built around manipulating others using an oppressive framework such as patriarchy.

        You’re basically being Ash in that Alien quote at the end of the article, only you ACTUALLY admire pickup artists and missed the part where xenomorphs are terrifying monsters that exist only to rape and murder.

      • I’m a pick up artist. I consider myself as a strong man with a strong character. I don’t manipulate girls to have sex with me. I only create attraction to make them manipulate me to have sex.

        • translated for normal people: ‘i’m extremely socially insecure and am frantically attempting to validate myself for some kind of traumatic past history’

          • This site is originally from dudes from LS. com. Its intended to put themselves on a pedestal and address blame to PUAs and women, Its meant to see themselves as heroes and others who have different and original opinions as abnormal.

  2. This article seems overly biased against PUAs. While some PUAs and their philosophies are questionable it is mostly harmless.
    Many of them speak about “building attraction” rather than stripping a woman of her ability/right to reject

  3. hahaha someone got fucked by a pickup artist and now regrets it, jesus, im surprised you didnt try to get the dude charged with rape

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  5. I am what you could call a pick up artist. The number one thing I teach is to believe in your personal value, and be naturally comfortable with yourself. I don’t teach people to lie, insult or trick people but instead to have natural confidence and playfully tease. When you have a sense of true self belief everything should take care of itself and attraction should follow. The only thing left is to actually approach people. Btw, I fucked 3 girls this week and all of them were more than happy to follow me back to my place.

    • “The number one thing I teach is to believe in your personal value, and be naturally comfortable with yourself. BY THE WAY, YOU BIG JERK, I FUCKED 3 GIRLS THIS WEEK, SO THERE. I’M COOL”

  6. I don’t have any wide knowledge of pickup artists, but I watched a disturbing, and yes, disgusting video made by one of these lowlife types:
    and was horrified by the cruelty and the almost criminal nature of what he was doing to the “target” (I mean, the woman) in this video. I’d appreciate any comments anyone makes here. It has proved almost impossible to even get anyone to watch this video. Of course I am not promoting it, but to understand the incident you have to watch it at least once.

    I also made a transcript, because it is hard to follow the dialog unless you watch it several times — not a pleasant experience. So, I’m going to paste in the transcript here in hopes of getting some feedback on this man’s conduct. I think the woman’s behavior was fine. She did talk back, got angry, and made a fuss — which, though I can’t see why, evidently is considered a worse offense than what this slimeball was doing to her! Here’s the transcript. Thanks in advance to anyone who comments.
    At the start of the video, Woman is standing inside a book store or coffee shop. She is wearing a dark raincoat and might be in her early twenties, or possibly younger. Woman speaks to someone behind the counter.
    Woman: Thank you.
    Woman turns and goes out the glass front door of the store.
    A man follows Woman outside. This man calls his youtube channel Good Looking Loser.
    Woman is seated at an outdoor table holding a cigarette and drinking something (cold) through a straw. Good Looking Loser approaches Woman’s table, but we cannot see him. He is shooting this video from a concealed camera at about the level of his chest.
    Good Looking Loser: How are you?
    Woman: Hi.
    Good Looking Loser: How’s it going?
    Woman: Uh, ok, how are you?
    Good Looking Loser: I’m ok.
    Good Looking Loser pulls out metal chair from the table with a loud scraping sound. He sits down.
    Good Looking Loser: I know it’s a little, uh… random, but I thought you were attractive, and I wanted to come and say hi to you.
    Woman nods and smiles very briefly, her face returning instantly to neutral.
    Woman: Thank you.
    Good Looking Loser: I’m Chris.
    Woman: Hi.
    Good Looking Loser: Nice to meet you.
    Woman: Nice to meet you.
    Good Looking Loser: And your name is … ?
    Woman: Do I have to give it out?
    Good Looking Loser: Uuuum, for the purposes of, like, normal conversation, I think so.
    Woman: Yeah, well, who said I started this conversation?
    Good Looking Loser: Yeah, what’s your name?
    Woman: You’re just asking me my name? You don’t even know me!
    Good Looking Loser gives a little laugh.
    Good Looking Loser: Right, exactly.
    Woman: Well, don’t you want to get to know me before you try to get my name and number, like all guys?
    Good Looking Loser: Uuuuhmmm…
    Woman: You think oh I’m pretty so you’re just going to come out and try to get my number and then, oh, try to sleep with me, like all guys? Make a baby and then head out?
    Good Looking Loser: You serious?
    Woman: Well, isn’t that what all guys do?
    Good Looking Loser: Not really.
    Woman: Well, then, 90 percent of them do.
    Good Looking Loser: I think, uh…
    Woman: And I highly doubt you’re the other 10 percent.
    Good Looking Loser: I’m not. I’m not.
    Woman: You’re not.
    Good Looking Loser: I’m not.
    Woman: Exactly! So you’re the player, douchebag type.
    Good Looking Loser: Uh, Right.
    Woman: So what are you doing talking to me?
    Good Looking Loser: You’re a douche. You’re a douchebag.
    Woman: I’m a douchebag?
    Good Looking Loser: You’re a douchebag.
    Woman: When you’re the one that came to me?
    Good Looking Loser: You’re a douchebag.
    Woman: (raising her voice) I’m a douchebag?
    Good Looking Loser: Yeah.

    Woman: Thank you! Why don’t you just, stop talking to me? You’re the one that WALKED UP TO ME. YOU CAN LEAVE NOW!
    Good Looking Loser: Your mom’s a douchebag.
    Woman: And your daddy’s a player, douche bag, loser, slash motherfucker, and (unintelligible).
    GOOD LOOKING LOSER is laughing.
    Good Looking Loser: Are you serious?
    Woman: Yes.
    Good Looking Loser: Yeah?
    Good Looking Loser: I don’t actually believe that you’re, um… (pause) Are you serious?
    Woman: Am I serious.
    Good Looking Loser: You seem like a sweet girl. You know?
    Woman: (sharply) Yeah, well, you just know how to judge people correctly, don’t you? Are you God?
    Good Looking Loser: Oh my god.
    Woman: You know everybody in their heart, and what they’re like, by their LOOKS,
    Good Looking Loser: Hey, let’s try this again.
    Woman: Judge a book by its cover? “Oh, she’s pretty, so I think she’s NICE, too!”
    Woman: No, most pretty people are BITCHES.
    Good Looking Loser: (laughs)
    Woman: I’m sorry, we get so much good looks, that everyone douchebags and players decide to… (breaks off in frustration)
    Good Looking Loser: Wait, you lost me, explain that again?
    Woman: (sighs) If you’re pretty,…
    Good Looking Loser: Uh, before that,
    Woman: players…
    Good Looking Loser: Before that. Slightly before that.
    Woman: What are you talking about? You being God and knowing people?
    Good Looking Loser: You know what? (pause) No, but… yeah, clear that up for me too.
    Woman: You just said, “Oh you’re pretty so I thought you were nice too.” You judged me. You assumed something that you did not know.
    Good Looking Loser: Right.
    Woman: So why are you assuming things? Did you not get taught to… judge… or to… know something?
    Good Looking Loser: We can do this one more time, one more time. Hi, I thought you were attractive, I wanted to come say hi. Hi I’m Chris, what’s your name? What’s your name?
    Good Looking Loser reaches across the table and touches Woman’s hand.
    Woman: You thought I was “attractive” so that’s all the reason you’ve taken me.
    Woman: So if I was some ugly bitch, you would have NOTHING to do with me.
    Good Looking Loser: Ummm… largely… Pretty much.
    Woman: Oh…
    Good Looking Loser: You know what I’m saying?
    Woman: Yeah, you’re cold hearted.
    Good Looking Loser: Yeah.
    Woman: Like all guys.
    Good Looking Loser: (taunting) I’m God. (pause) You said it. You said it.
    Woman: You are? So, if I were to pick up a chair and smack you across the head, you wouldn’t die.
    Good Looking Loser: Uuuuhm…
    Woman: Why are you still talking to me?
    Good Looking Loser: Go for it. Go for it. Try it. Lady, you’re…
    Woman: If I didn’t go to jail, I would!
    Good Looking Loser: Lady, you’re crazy.
    Woman: Yeah, well…
    Good Looking Loser: You’re crazy.
    Woman: (shakes her head).
    Good Looking Loser: You forgetting to take your medicine this morning?
    Woman: (laughs mirthlessly) Yeah, I did. My medicine is coffee. Coffee, caffeine. (sighs and laughs again the same way).
    Good Looking Loser: You’re … what?
    Woman: Oh, I almost want to… waste my coffee on your head.
    Good Looking Loser: Don’t do that.
    Woman: I won’t do that, ’cause this is my medicine.
    Good Looking Loser: Don’t do that.
    Woman: (indicates cigarette she is holding) And this is my…
    Good Looking Loser: Do you watch the Dr. Phil show?
    Woman: Do I watch the Dr. Phil show.
    Good Looking Loser: Do you watch the Dr. Phil show?
    Woman: Of course I do, because they’re all about douchebags and players.
    Good Looking Loser: You should go on the Dr. Phil show.
    Woman: YOU should go on the Dr. Phil show.
    Good Looking Loser: Your mom should go on the Dr. Phil show.
    Woman: You probably already have thousands of babies everywhere!
    GOOD LOOKING LOSER laughs several times.
    Woman: You think you’re funny.
    Good Looking Loser: What’s that?
    Woman: You think it’s funny, making a thousand babies and leaving ’em.
    Good Looking Loser: Uuummm… sort of. You see these police coming up here? I’m gonna… I’m gonna… I’m gonna like, tell them, uh, I’m gonna point you out to them. Hit me with the chair right now. I dare you. I dare you to hit me with the chair.
    Woman: Are you kidding me?
    Good Looking Loser: No, I’m serious! Hit me with the chair!
    Woman turns around and, with a loud scraping sound, slides a chair at the next table over to her table.
    Good Looking Loser: (calling out) Yo, she hits me with the chair! (laughter from police) You gotta get my back. You do.
    Policeman: (laughing) All right… (unintelligible)
    Good Looking Loser: You do!
    Woman: Now you’re protected.
    Good Looking Loser: Yeah!
    Woman: I am not going to jail over some DOUCHEBAG. (pause) oh, my gosh, someone here. (points at him over her head, yells to someone out of frame) LOSER! LOSER!
    Good Looking Loser: I didn’t know you…
    Woman: (yells) LOSER TRIED TO HIT ON ME!
    GOOD LOOKING LOSER laughs loudly.
    Good Looking Loser: Do you even smoke cigarettes? You’re just holding it.
    Woman looks down at cigarette in her hand.
    Woman: Well maybe if I didn’t have someone… distracting me… I would be.
    Woman picks up her purse, looks inside it.
    Good Looking Loser: I’m not leaving, you gotta get up and leave. You gotta get up and leave now.
    Woman: I gotta get up and leave.
    Good Looking Loser: Yeah, you could.
    Woman: (tensely, getting angrier) Really? (lights the cigarette).
    Good Looking Loser: What’s that? Yeah!
    Woman: Okay!
    Good Looking Loser: Seriously. I’m not going anywhere.
    Woman stands up.
    Woman: You want me to get up and leave?
    Woman does something at the table, out of frame.
    Good Looking Loser: Lady, you are in… (stammering) for… in six years, I’ve never seen someone as crazy as you. I’m dead serious.
    Woman: (still standing over him) Guess what! In twenty years, I’m sure you’ll find another!
    Title appears on screen: Lunatic tries to dump some coffee on me.
    Good Looking Loser: Oh my g … are you serious? You, you’re nuts! You’re nuts.
    Woman walks away from table.
    Good Looking Loser: (indignant) Don’t pour that shit on my head!
    Woman: Then why did you walk up to me?
    Good Looking Loser: Don’t pour that shit on my head!
    Woman: Maybe you should learn, how to get to know a person before you just hit on them!
    Woman: What is so funny?
    GOOD LOOKING LOSER gets up from the table.
    Good Looking Loser: Yeah, have a nice day. You’re cr… I’m not sure… I WILL leave.
    Woman: Yeah, you too. GOOD BYE!


  7. “Pick up” is just a euphemism for better life skills to be happy. Unless you’re stupid and like nerdy techniques, then good for you.

    Women are too worried that ‘techniques’ similar to what THEY have always used on men are falling to the wrong side of the equation. They don’t like these ‘networks’ of men that support and share the art of finesse with women – only women are supposed to have these special advantages, so they think. That is just insecurity and women – the original brilliant seduction artists – should relax, because we’re both evolving, moving forward and everyone will be happier. The best of the best.

    We’re restoring the male/female polarity women complain they don’t feel in men anymore. We’re breaking out of old paradigms and bad social programming we just had no idea were unnecessary. We’re becoming better people in a world in which women are finally treated equal in the past few generations, with many changes since that began. So… everyone, take responsibility for your life. It’s time!

    • Great post fellow human being! I have few words about this topic. First off I am utterly amazed that there is a person called JONZE on this kind of blog, who actually is level-headed and smart.

      Now: You own your life. You arent a victim. Humans evolve fast. We live in a rapidly changing world where you need to either adapt or get defeated. Your life is yours. No one else owns your life but you. You choose how you feel and you are not entiteld to blame others for it. If you have been “brain washed”, then own it, acknowledge it and change for the better. Why does women need to get pregnant for you when she can die and her life could be wrecked to ruins because of your anger, emotion and social issues and behaviour? No one owes you anything. Life is a market and feminism doesnt mean that men and women are equal AT ALL, AT EVERY GODDAMN LIFE STAGE. Dont be fools to believe that women and men are equal. They are not. As a man you will have to earn things. Remember that. Evolve, change and create better coping skills to battle and survive in this planet. No one is a victim in this world except the decaded and animals. Life is a rapidly changing thing, get top on things and you are much better.

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  9. Its your own fault and life decision to be loveless and a Love- shy. If you are LS, you are that kind of a person, who has failed in his love life and is bitter about it. Its all about a certain thought pattern, which you can escape from and have power over. Someone is a refugee, someone is mentally sick and someone is physically crippled. Everyone is that way by birth or as a result of countless choices. Every LS person is accountable of their lives. In life you have to cope and survive. Being single is a challenge, where your manhood is put into test.

    PUA cold approach is a certain kind of struggle of the extistence of your genes. If you refuse to cold approach by an excuse like “its not my character” or “my self-esteem is not high enough”, you are a coward. In life, you’ll have to work hard for your earnings and success. If there is time, why not read self-help books or go to bars. Gain social experience, so you’ll learn to identify womens needs rather than to delusionally insult and character assasiante them.

    PUA puts women to a pedestal, it has been said. But why not put your future wife or the love of your life to the spot of a special person? This is quite biased, and it tells me that you are some bums who want to return to the medieval times where men didnt have to put his womans needs above his own.

    All in all, what is characteristic about LS persons is to give up too easily, get bitter and blame women of all of his own feelings, life decisions and failures. Each and everyone creates a life that symbolises him/herself. Angry and bitter posting, behaving and bullying in the internet fits to the LS mans profile perfectly. According to you, everyone should change his/hers behaviour except you.

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